waider: (Default)
waider ([personal profile] waider) wrote2003-12-15 11:13 am

the big news

Not to be picky or anything, but
"...Rumsfeld said the United States would abide by the Geneva Conventions in its treatment of him."
... except that bit about televising him undergoing a medical inspection while in captivity, which some commentators had no hesitation in describing as showing him in a humiliating light. But, shrug. Well done, guys, you got your man.

[identity profile] ikkyu2.livejournal.com 2003-12-15 08:15 am (UTC)(link)
I went through several of the Geneva Conventions when they pulled that awful stunt with Uday and Qusay. I couldn't find anything in them prohibiting the televising of prisoners. The 1860's convention from the time of the American Civil War has something in it about not 'parading prisoners about', but obviously that was before television. I think the idea was that you don't put prisoners on scary deathmarches.

I agree that it's not appropriate, though.
ext_181967: (Default)

[identity profile] waider.livejournal.com 2003-12-15 08:29 am (UTC)(link)
That would be right here:
1. Persons taking no active part in the hostilities, including members of armed forces who have laid down their arms and those placed hors de combat by sickness, wounds, detention, or any other cause, shall in all circumstances be treated humanely, without any adverse distinction founded on race, colour, religion or faith, sex, birth or wealth, or any other similar criteria.

To this end the following acts are and shall remain prohibited at any time and in any place whatsoever with respect to the above-mentioned persons:
[...]
(c) Outrages upon personal dignity, in particular, humiliating and degrading treatment;
(emphasis mine). I could also, I guess, have highlighted the bit about "those placed hors de combat by...detention".

[identity profile] ikkyu2.livejournal.com 2003-12-15 01:27 pm (UTC)(link)
a) You can argue that, by being the titular head of state and commander-in-chief of presumably at least one resistance group, that he did not give up 'active part in the hostilities' by failing to use his pistol. He would have done so if he had unconditionally surrendered on behalf of himself and his rebel forces. Instead, he said he was 'willing to negotiate', which is to be construed that he was not in fact unconditionally surrendering.

There's also a case to be made that detaining him does not place him hors de combat until he publically surrenders, for the same reason.

b) I object strongly to the idea that a medical examination is humiliating, degrading, or outrageous to personal dignity. And there's nothing here about publishing or putting on TV things that are not outrageous to personal dignity.

Again, I'll reiterate that the actions were clearly inappropriate. I also think that they were clearly NOT in violation of any of the Geneva Conventions, and that the allegation shouldn't be lightly made.